vkn

David the good or not?

7 posts in this topic

Hi, Huge problem these days.. such authors do not know how to make an aquaponics work nor does literally know what a right aquaponics is or could produce, so talking about!

David the good, or not?  Says, "I am over the aquaponics virus!  If you think I’m wrong, tell me how – I’d like to hear your thoughts."

http://www.thesurvivalgardener.com/aquaponics-non-miracle-complicated-mess-endured/

Any thoughts on this?

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Hi vkn 

I think he is right & wrong :unsure: a good read and food for thought 

You have to do it "right", in the right environment IMO 

I think there is a load of thoughts & wisdom on this matter in this thread in particular 

cheers

NilliamSuby and vkn like this

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23 hours ago, vkn said:

Hi, Huge problem these days.. such authors do not know how to make an aquaponics work nor does literally know what a right aquaponics is or could produce, so talking about!

David the good, or not?  Says, "I am over the aquaponics virus!  If you think I’m wrong, tell me how – I’d like to hear your thoughts."

http://www.thesurvivalgardener.com/aquaponics-non-miracle-complicated-mess-endured/

Any thoughts on this?

Hi 

Here is a summary on the economics of aquaponics in Nordic Countrys (Iceland/Denmark/Norway)

from this doc/pdf

http://nordicinnovation.org/Global/_Publications/Reports/2015/P11090 - Aquaponics RAPPORT -13 01 16.pdf

NORDIC INNOVATION PUBLICATION 2015:06 // MAY 2015

Quote :

1.4. The economy of aquaponics

Serious studies on the economics of aquaponics are almost zero, and the ones that exist areoften narrative based. Another weak point is that conclusions are often closely related tospecific production systems growing specific types of fish and plant cultures. This makes it difficult to compare economic performances among aquaponics systems, as well as identifying ‘windows of opportunity’ when prices on the fish or horticultural product examined, changes.

Likewise, despite the many talks on the various symbiotic effects of aquaponics, the systemalso creates a dependency, and so increases the economic risks of the producer engaging in aquaponics production if a failure in one of the two biological systems should occur. For these reasons, aquaponic still performs at a smaller scale, and often built around do-it-yourselfsystems where the products are catering for flexible small bulk local markets.

However, if one is to see the growth of aquaponics, not only in the number of producers, but also at a level on a more industrial fashion and scale, the economics has to be more visible andscientifically based.

To commence such process of visibility the contribution margin accounting (the results of subtracting all variable expenses from revenues, and indicate the amount from sales to coverthe fixed expenses and profit) is a good way to start. It creates visibility on the various costs, aswell as on what conditions the income is based (Adler et al, 2001). In the following, the various contribution margins from the aquaponics systems in the project will be present.

Use of aquaponics systems has been subject to increasing interest in recent years due to a general interest in sustainable production methods, to reduce the use of non-renewable resources and combat climate change. From a purely economic point of view, aquaponicsproduction has the advantage of utilizing nutrients from the fish production as fertilizers in theplant production. The economic value of these nutrients is however, relatively small compared to the additional costs of making them available to the plant production. In aquaponicproduction you need expertise on both fish- and plant production, and the optimization of a combined production is complicated. This makes it difficult to make aquaponics production competitive to traditional commercial fish and plant production. It is therefore important toinclude the additional value a product can have when produced in an aquaponics system, a value related to the sustainability and other characteristics of the production.

Consumers may be willing to pay a premium for aquaponics products based on thesustainability and lack of use of artificial fertilizers, parallel to the additional price on “organic”or eco-labelled products.

Local communities, particularly in urban areas, may be willing to pay a premium for locally produced food including educational and recreational values. “Urban farming” is a concept based on this.

Society may be willing to pay subsidy to support development of more eco-friendly productions, just as subsidies on organic productions or renewable energy.

INTRODUCTION 21

22 AQUAPONICS NOMA (NORDIC MARINE)

Aquaponics production is still at a stage comparable to wind mill electricity production 30 years ago, with small mills that were not able to compete directly with electricity generated in traditional power plants. It was however realised that the need for climate friendly, sustainable productions makes it necessary to invest in the development of renewable energy sources. Today renewable energy is close to being commercially competitive to traditional energy production. Both “organic” farming and windmill energy has grown from being small- scale niche product to be large-scale commercial productions. It is expected that aquaponicsproduction will develop likewise. It is therefore important to be first-movers in this process inorder to be able to exploit the innovation potential.

Quote end

The hole doc/pdf is a general good read for anybody, and a must read for someone planing to start a commercial (or hobby) AP operation in Iceland/Denmark/Norway IMO

This thread is also worth reading on the matter IMO

  cheers

vkn likes this

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Hi again

Seems Davids video cost so much controversy, that he pulled it from youtube :lol:

Anyhow here is RobBobs answer, enjoy

 

cheers

vkn likes this

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Posted (edited)

Interesting finds, Ande..  read over the comments and verbal volleys.. clearly there are frogs in several shallow wells.

There was this question asked by someone and I was equally intrigued by that -  "Why is aquaponics still a topic 30-40 years after it was actually new?"

Edited by vkn (see edit history)

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Hi vkn

Yeah I'w read thru comments, in the various blogs/videos/posts.

Funny to see how strong opinions many people hold on the matters, even though they hold little or non experience/knowledge, in the different disciplines. 

Not so funny to see/read the degrading & viscous opinions, aimed at persons, rather than the subject of discussion.  

Unfortunately that way of communication is very dominant, on all kinds of social media (including forums) and we all loose out on loads of good stuff for that reason IMO

I'w seen so many good posters drop out or disappear do to trolling over the years.  

I made this comment in a different thread (same topic) some years back, and that's still my opinion on the matter

 

On 29.1.2014 at 3:38 PM, ande said:

Hehe

 

these Q's or topics criss/cross a bit amongst each other IMO, so some times it's difficulte to stick to post/topic, when the same subject is raised across different threads, with the same persons involved in the disscussion :judge:

I don't belive that APhave to pay for it selfe but it can, even at a backyard or in a hobby level, given the right sircumstances, and those would more likely aper, if you have the land, buildings, any resources, or knowledge, on parts of the ap hobby in the baseline

But at a commercial ap level, it has to pay off, like any other buissnis, or you go bankrupt.

 

I can't think of a better pay off, than a nice big family/friend gathering/barbercue/etc., where you can serve your home grown produce/veg, and/or raised/hunted/fished/gathered meat & fish :D:bbq::camp::rock:

It can't be bought for money, you got to do it. Being able to, is a privelege in it's own selfe :bow: so if that value is put in. then what ?

 

 

cheers

 

Edit: I forgot to mention serving strawberries and blueberries homegrown or wild harwested yum yum,

Or picking and eating directly in the garden/field, best time of the year here.

 

APcan easely pay of as lifestyle

cheers

GaryD likes this

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I found that whole discussion interesting...not the least for the reaction of the AP cultists.  Some people even accused David the Good of being controversial simply to generate traffic for his YouTube channel.

Typically, the focus was on the 'poster' rather than what he had to say.

I didn't agree with everything that David the Good had to say (nor with everything that Rob Gray had to say in rebuttal)...but I thought that it was entirely reasonable for him to canvass the perceived shortcomings of aquaponics...because aquaponics does indeed have some shortcomings.  It's only by taking 'an ongoing approach to continuous improvement' that integrated aquaculture will achieve its true potential.

Interestingly, the biggest issue of all...the absence of sustainability...wasn't addressed until I raised it.

Of course, all of this took place on Facebook groups...at least three of them...so the discussion lacks the cohesion (and regulation) that might have happened on discussion forums.

ande likes this

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